Mohamad Hadi Ataei

full interview

Can you introduce yourself?
I am Mohammad Hadi Ataei.

Where are you from?
From Nawar district. Province of Ghazni.

What kind of house do you live in?
In the camp inside container homes. With another family.

How is life here?
The other situation is too much … neither normal nor too much … not too much… I cannot tell really…

Who do you live with?
With my wife and other children. My wife, myself, we have two children and another child on the way. That’s all.

How do you spend your daily time? What job or occupation do you have?
No no. We have no work or occupation. Just to be honest, I go to the forest, I go here and there, and I go to the street. I do not have any entertainment. It was good if I had some sort of a pastime. No work and occupation at all. It is better to say that it has become a difficult situation.

What brings you joy and happiness here?
Pleasure for me is to have a job. When I have something to do. Or be a course. That I’d be busy studying.

What is your favorite thing right now in this camp?
Here, one day when I go to the grocery store, it is a pleasure for me. No more fun here. For example, it is a pleasure to do something for me here. Either go shopping or go for a walk. Going for a walk is not something you can do every day. Where shall I go? Just near the camp. These are the hobbies for me, to have a job or studying, these are my joy. I do not have anything else to enjoy.

What changes have taken place in your life since you arrived in Europe?
Changes in my life… only the security is good. Nobody asks where you are going, where you are not going. This is one good thing. What else? Freedom is good. From a financial, language and housing point of view the problems have increased. For example when I go to the city I can’t speak the language or for example problems like… mental issues. But a little bit of freedom, security, peace.

In other words, what was good and what was bad?
No bad thing. Just as I said, we are in the camp.  We do not have the acceptance. We do not have neither a hobby nor a job. These are bad. The good thing is we are free, safe. Nobody interferes in your life, where you go…

How does it feel to be in the situation that you are, with all its problems or good outcomes?
Just wait to see what happens. Patience. None of us feel anything at the moment.

What do you want to wait for?
Get an interview. Maybe we can get into the process, get a teacher, or have a job, something. This is our only hope.

Do you just hope? Just this?
We hope so. We have nothing more to say. We just hope I get accepted and get out of the camp. If there is a way I can go ahead to stand on my own feet.

Yes. How does it feel like to be away from your country or for example away from the rest of your relatives?
It’s a very sad feeling, they live in an area near the border where there is war going on, I am worried. My father, my mother, my brothers. Because there is a difference of two hours between us, Ghazni and Nawar district. There is a war between Nawar district and our region. Talib has gone too far. Talib, ISIS, Kuchi, they have gone there, if you look through social media there is a war. One person was killed. I am very worried. What would happen to my father, what would happen to my mother. My parents are old. I am very worried about them. In terms of their safety. My only concern is their safety and their health.

The feeling of worry that you have, what effect does it have on your life?
You mean this sadness in my head?

No, the same feeling that you have now. Are you worried about your family or your parents? What effect does it have on you?
I am just thinking in my mind. Sad. Why this? I am safe now. I either eat a piece of dry or wet bread. I have something to eat. We do not have a problem. But I am worried about the situation, for example the news would be like the region is occupied by Taliban, or… someone is killed. I am worried about these things.

Do you think or imagine that if you are in that situation you can cope with that?
When I left Afghanistan there was a war going on. I made a worse decision than this. I suffered a lot in Iran as well. Turkey was much worse than these problems. Because my baby was sick, and a doctor was not willing to look at him at all. He just said give me 400 Lira to have your baby in the hospital. The child was about to die. I was willing my whole life just to make this child well. Turkey was very hard for me. There were many more problems. The sea. We were on the sea for nine hours. They threw us into the sea at 8:30 at night and pulled us up at 5 a.m. in the morning. The phones were out of service. Just imagine, I had a one- and two-month-old kid and another one-year-and-three-month-old kid holding in my arms. The other one was seven years old. Think it was 95 percent death. We saw death with our own eyes. I repeat, whether to be in Afghanistan or in the sea it doesn’t matter. It got a little easier when I got to this side again. At least this risk to life was eliminated. Here we came from Samsoraki we were on the water for more than eight hours.

Did you imagine this situation in the camp?
I had imagined living in a container home, but hadn’t imagined several families in one… no. Like women and children cannot come out of the house very much. You can‎’t yell at the child so as not to make noise. Should I take the child out or lock the child in the room? I didn’t even think about that.

Your wife didn’t imagine as well?
Yeah. She does not imagine it. Because I said maybe it could be a container house or a tent, I was satisfied. I even told them several times to give me a tent, then I’m ok with that.

How are they attending to your problems? Camp problems.
Well, I went to the manager several times, I told the manager to give me a small container house or a tent where my neighbor is not bothering my younger child. He didn’t listen. I went several times. I went there for the doctor a few more times. We went because of my feet; we went because of epilepsy. In the 10th month. Month Nine he gave me an appointment. They did not pay much attention. This became my habit. To wait. Endure.

You must put up with it.
Yes. I must be patient.

How did you cope with this situation? With the current situation in the camp.
I am just having fun with the kids.

Your children?
Yes. My children. I cannot go. I wash clothes. Make a phone call or go around. Just to do something. To be entertained.

Do you think you had the ability to cope with this situation inside the camp from before the journey or that you gained it afterwards?
Well, I think that if we are in the camp for another six months, maybe I will get another disease, or a mental problem. Because a lot of people are here. OK? If, during this six month, I have had enough. Because I came here on Christmas day. These six or seven months I struggled a lot. True, I’m here in free Europe, but we’re not happy inside the house. I went to the manager and told him to give me a separate container home or tent. Because I cannot imprison the child for twenty-four hours or keep him out for twenty-four hours. They did not pay attention to me. I don’t know what to do. What should I do? 

Where do you think you got the ability to cope with this situation? What are you hoping for? 
I hope for a better tomorrow. I bear that tomorrow I may see comfort behind this hardship and misery.

Do you think you gained the ability to cope with your current situation or you had it in you from before?
My tolerance has also decreased… my tolerance. But I have three doctor prescriptions. We have a dermatologist, we have a neurologist, and we have an orthopedist. But I have three doctor prescriptions here. I had been in Afghanistan, there was war, there was strife, but at home you were at least asleep, you were comfortable. Because there was a little kid, baby… his mother was… now there are three, there are two, one … Because it cannot be with three children, and it is difficult.

You mean you feel weaker than before?
Yes.

It means that you had more problems before, but now your patience and endurance have decreased.
I still have a lot of problems. I did not mean these problems. I meant my patience. Problems … that now … we are in another camp.

In this condition…
Well, we are like this… with these facilities…

What effect has the coronavirus had on your daily life, your mood, your emotions?
Coronavirus… in this camp… Before that, there was no program in this camp, or it is not now. Before corona, I went to school a few times because of something. I was not infected. Corona inside the camp does not differ, it does not matter. My only concern was that Afghanistan had taken the corona, where our families settled because there were no facilities. My mother had trouble breathing. Just worry about me from the other side. Our area is no longer a village, neither a doctor, nor a proper car. There is no way to the hospitals at night through the desert because there is war. I’m worried about the corona on the other side. We did not have a special program here. Before the corona and after the corona. No, corona had no effect on my life anymore. My city, we went here and there, and we observed.

If we go back in time, what was the reason you left your country?
We left Afghanistan because of war and insecurity and things like that, and after I got married in the countryside, I came to Ghazni. I also lived in Ghazni where Pashto languages ​​were neighbors. I was a neighbor, after the war started, Taleb and ISIS became our neighbors. They took over the houses. I saw that they hit the neighbors.

What do they hit?
When the war started, they would take the houses.

It became a refuge for the Taliban?
Yes. It became a refuge for the Taliban. We either had to be there… and endure. For endurance we had nothing. You could not endure with stone and wood. We had to run away. We were going to the countryside. We were going to the countryside, it was blocking the way, towards Qiagh (a district in Ghazni province) We were forced to go towards Kabul. When we came to Kabul, Taleb would block the road, wherever we went the Talebs were there. We came to Kabul, we had to get a passport from Kabul, and we came to Iran. We did not go to Ghazni anymore.

Why didn’t you go to other cities?
Which city?

Other cities in Afghanistan.
Now, everywhere in Afghanistan, there is no security, there is no security in Afghanistan. An Afghan city is safe, everyone goes there. Every city in Afghanistan that you say is security, if you look at the media, there are only ten killed, fifteen killed and twenty killed. The same cities do not have security in Afghanistan. That city where the insecure are killed every day. War. Afghanistan, whose capital is Kabul, is at war every day. There is no place to live anymore. It is very hard to imagine. Basically, Afghanistan became a war, someone else [city] is not a war. Thirty-four provinces, now 70 percent of Afghanistan is in the hands of the Taliban, ISIS and terrorists. Seventy percent. Twenty-five percent of them are protected by the same pro-Taliban government or American government for twenty-four hours. There is no place for strangers.

How did you feel when you left the country?
I just lost my life there. I just said go today to a place where I can sleep at night and not worry about tomorrow.

What exactly was your feeling at that time?
My exact feeling was to get out of this battlefield. Worried about my family, I became hesitant. My heart was cut in half. Half of it was on the mother’s side, it was the family. Half this way. Finally, we came to Iran. Iran was good for five or six months. Then I told the girl to go to school. They did not accept her for school. Not the first year, not the second. Everywhere we went, they said you have nothing. You have nothing. I had to come this way.

How was your trip to Europe?
My trip to Europe was with smugglers. Mountains, plains, and deserts.

Is there anything special or specific that you want to say? On the way, for example, what happened, or exactly the whole way, you walk on foot, or, for example, most of them come from the water. They come by water. What is something special you want to say?
Not a special event anymore. I just got caught by a thief. Istanbul. He stole a lot of our money. We were in a smuggling dormitory in Turkey. It was very hard for us. There were eighteen of us in a room nine meters away. There were seventeen of us. You could not stretch your legs like you had to sit and sleep in a sitting position. My child became sick and couldn’t breathe. The door was locked. Whatever I did it didn’t open. After 25 days of such problems, after that we had to go and get a house. We got a house and then we came this way. We were caught by the Turkish police, the gendarmes, they separated my wife and children from me. I was imprisoned for seven days. Then they released my wife and kids. But they did not release me. Where were my wife and children with a hundred pleas, quarrels, cries, and noise? Then he left my wife and children. I was looking for a wife and children. Then he gave me a piece of paper for thirty days. He said it would be thirty days and if it took time, we would deport you. Then we went home…  I found a smuggler and when we came this way I did not leave the house at all. I was sending my wife shopping. I was home for twenty-four hours.

It was hard. What was the way from Iran to Turkey?
Iran–Turkey road, the Iranian police, who did not see us, but the Turkish police, who once stopped us at the border and released us. Then came a second time. But in the camp where we were, three or seventeen days were very difficult. We were at Camp One for seventeen days. We used to burn during the sun and freeze from the cold at nights. A place a thousand meters for a hundred people, one hundred and eighty and fifty people. When the police came, they separated the deportation. He did not say anything that was like a human being, he just said bad words. He was cursing people’s mothers and sisters. It was very hard for us. Seventeen days. Since we came to Istanbul, Istanbul also had a lot of problems.

What happened to Iran–Turkey?
No no no, nothing special happened to us.

How long did it take?
From where to where?

Iran to Turkey.
Iran–Turkey one day and night.

A full day?
Yes. A full day.

Was your way a hill, a mountain or…?
It was a mountain.

Wouldn’t it be hard for you?
That was hard. We were just saying hopefully we won’t get captured. We had two legs; we borrowed the other two legs {an idiom that means we went as quick as possible}. Just cross the hill, cross the mountain. Everyone was thinking about their lives.

How did you feel when those things happened?
What happened?

The same events, such as Camp One, or the dormitory of smugglers, or you were in the water for nine hours.
I would kill myself if something would have happened to my wife and children. Because I did not have the patience to lose my wife and children in this way, for example, only to save my life. I must have been doing something myself that I did not want to live anymore. My life was useless without my wife and children. If either they drowned in the sea or were freezing in a mountain hut, my baby, or my wife or my daughter. Life was of no use to me anymore.

What do you think about the same things that happened?
I think about them at night, what days have I spent! When thoughts of it come back to me, I can’t go back to sleep!

Is there something specific that you see daily, for example, or something specific, do you remember those events? There is an example of someone who remembers what happened in the sea when he sees water.
I tremble when I see a boat passing on a car. I look behind until the car disappears in the distance. We got on that boat. It was night, the sea was dark, and the sea was not much. I only remember the boat when I see it.

What else? Any other specific thing?
That night until morning my baby cried in the water. I think my baby is crying. I hugged the baby and carried it here and there because it was the sound of water, my baby was scared. I put the girl at the top of the boat under me so she would not see the water. My wife, who was so scared, wouldn’t talk at all. Nothing… I bought a tube myself. My tube was torn by the sea. I was without a tube. Then my wife bought a vest, but she did not wear it. I said wear it. She said if we die, we die together, I don’t want to stay alive alone … My child cried until he could not get out of the small boat. A voice cried. I said the child is hungry and thirsty. He did not eat anything we gave him. Only fear. I… fell asleep. I had been awake from morning till night, I was exhausted. The same thing [I remember] I wake up from. Because the first two or three hours were stormy there. The boat was shutting down at all. His voice was lost. I said we went under water. The boat is like this. After the first three hours, it gradually got better. I mean, I remember this boat or that Camp Van, it’s very difficult for me. Even more is the sea…

How do you feel when you remember those moments?
Now I think about what days we had. If I knew all these would happen one day, I would be happy to die and not come this way. I was happy for the Taliban to capture me that day and kill me, but I did not throw myself into that situation. Because when you start this journey, it’s hard to pull back. It is not up to you to pull back; it was no longer possible for us to come out from Camp One. We had to go through the steps. In the sea as well. When you got on the boat you had to go on even until death.

What happened that currently affects your daily life?
It is one hundred percent effective. It stays in my mind and I will never forget them. Like Camp Van and like the sea and Istanbul where the thief stole our money, these are remembered.

What is the current effect on you? For example, there are changes in your condition, in your behavior.
In my own behavior I try not to remember.

What if it comes again?
When I remember, I go into deep thoughts. I drown in those thoughts. Maybe someone will call me two or three times and I’ll answer back only for the fourth time. It makes me think. I think a lot about what a day it was, in what situation I threw myself. The day of the journey in the sea, we sailed to Turkey. It was very hard.

Have you ever imagined that you would cope with such a situation, for example, or that these things would happen to you?
Sea, I did not think these things would happen to me. Sea. Same for Camp; I didn’t think of it as such. Because Turkey was an Islamic country, we said that its behavior would be 100 percent better. I did not think of these.

Did you think that you could cope with this situation?
No. I knew the situation when I said I was not coming. The camp they gave the camp, I thought so. I thought we would go to the camp and live in a house container, but I did not think it would be with two families, two people living in the same house. But I did not think about Turkey and the road and the sea. I did not think of Iran when those problems arose. I said no. Afghanistan, which has always preached that Islam has mercy, has compassion. Well, when I saw this, I was disappointed. If I knew I would not come.

How do you deal with what happened right now, with bad memories, for example?
Memories, well, I just say to myself that one day God willing things will proceed, and I get an acceptance, find a job… I spend my time with work and life. Have something to spend my time with. Be a job, be a lesson.

What plan do you currently have to deal with those memories, for example, or can you forget them?
No, they will not be forgotten.

Did you not even decide or plan?
The sea and Istanbul and Camp Van and these have filled my brain… these things. I think I will remember this everywhere I go in the world. The night that my baby was crying, he was scared. Later, when we arrived and were rescued, my baby calmed down. It was a cold Christmas that day. When we got off that boat, he fell asleep. In that cold weather. We got off the ship and our feet froze. My child is tired of fighting. That is, I said that if these two hours are three hours, it is likely to weaken. That is, I saw life and death with my own eyes.

It was really hard. When you did not decide to come to Iran, from Iran to Turkey, from Turkey to Greece… when you hadn’t decided to come to Europe, for example. What was your dream for the future at that time? I mean, what did you want to be in the future?
My wish was for Afghanistan to be calm, to earn a piece of bread, for my child not to be a worker like myself. To study, get a job. My only wish was that the future of my children would not be ruined. Like me, Talib came when I was a child, Talib, massacre of Mazar and took Bamiyan two years later. The Taliban came to our region from Bamiyan. I do not know if I was eight years old or seven years old. I was nine years old, I remember between seven and nine. Talib came to our area. In our area everyone fled. I was looking after the sheep. Everyone fled, I was left alone. My father could not find me wherever he went. I was looking after the sheep. Then I saw that they all fled and left. Then I saw the Kalashnikov sound coming. Then the Taliban took me. Seven or eight years old. Then asked me, where is your father, I said we do not know. This is our house. I do not know what happened anymore. Then I saw my parents over my head. I saw that they tortured, beat, and then left. From then on, he was found to have a foot disease. Headache was found. From then on, I got into trouble and suffering. I did not have a good day to say that our body was healthy after that. I dream of football, football was gone, I could not have a sore foot. Or wish…  I would go, I would find a headache. Everything I did not work out. I went to the doctor in Iran, I went to the doctor in Afghanistan. From then on, I went through my problems and said let me see what my child’s future will be.

When you decided to come to Iran, from Iran to Turkey, from Turkey to Greece, what was it then, what was your dream then?
When I came from Afghanistan to Iran I did not want to go to Turkey and Europe.

Was it just Iran?
It was just Iran. I told him to go to Iran and live there. I will work. Earn a living for my wife and children. When we came to Iran, we were there for about one year and two years, the school did not accept my daughter. Whatever I did, the school did not accept it. She handed me a piece of paper and said, “If the police catch you in Iran you can’t cross the border.” It was a year and a half, then he said it was inevitable. The police will arrest you and deport you. So, my daughter was not accepted for school, and I was illegal. I had no choice but to come. And I really wanted to be in Turkey and live in Turkey and not go to Europe. When I came to Turkey, it was worse than Iran. I had to come this way.

What exactly was your dream when you came to Greece? 
When I came to Greece, I said I was going to Greece, all I wanted was to be safe, for my children to go to school, I did not mean Greece, I meant to go to Germany, to go to France, to go to Switzerland. I do not mean in Greece. I live in Greece. I wanted to go to France, Germany, and Switzerland. That I will be accepted there, then my child will study, I will work myself. This is a quiet, everyday life.

That is, exactly what job did you have in mind for the future?
My job in Iran was painting.

Painting?
Yes, painting. Well, I did painting. I worked in painting, I worked in carpet weaving. I worked as a carpenter.

Right now, here, you have to consider a job.
This is my job as a painter. painting a sofa and a wooden door and window. I worked around for a year and a half. If I can’t work with painting, I work in a building. The efficiency of a building that I can, should not be as heavy as aluminum doors and windows.

Painting the doors and the sofa and these things?
Yes. Exactly.

Before you left your country, what did you see as your ability to succeed?
Like work?

No. To reach the goal.
My goal was to go to Iran, I saw the work situation in Iran, and I did not reach my goal. I had come to Iran when I was in trouble of Iran, and now my goal was forgotten.

What was your ability, for example? What was your first opportunity to leave Afghanistan? What ability did you see in yourself?
We were able to keep my wife and children calm, and I did whatever you wanted. In terms of work. My leg hurts, I can bear it, but I earned it for my wife. Like sales, waste, these things. Or the light construction work. Or the work that is not heavy, the damage is not great. I saw again that if it was not possible, I would go and do heavy work. Heavy work was a few days, but my leg hurt a lot. I could not, so I came back for something.

Are you still with the same motive? For example, do you want to go with your family?
Calm down, my family is my wife, my little girl. My wife, these are the ones who endured this hardship, let us not endure this hardship anymore. Little by little, for example, I am now thirty-three years old, about thirty-three years old. Thirty-two, thirty-three years I did not drink a glass of comfortable water not to say what Afghanistan and what way and how far we have come. I want to live more calmly and comfortably from now on, no matter what happens to us. Earn a piece of bread for myself. In comparison, the rest of my life I sit in the camp, and they give me a piece of bread, whether the government will give it or not. I want to stand on my feet. Do my own thing.

On the way one sees very difficult things, it is difficult with a smuggler…
This is really a very difficult way. Because if we went from ​​Samos or Lesbos or Chios it would take forty minutes to an hour. It was nine hours for our journey. Nine hours, in an inflatable boat that was not very trustable. We set ourselves up in this way.

So the difficulty you saw on the way, do you think that the experience made you grow and progress, or did you see good things in your journey? For example, good things have happened.
I was just hoping that if we don’t drown, these hardships might shine a light for us. We were hoping.

You only hoped.
We just hoped that after all these hard days there will be light. We only had this hope. What other hope could we have?

What effect does it have on you? For example, anyone who sees a difficulty or a problem, or progresses or, for example, is disappointed. How were you? Have you made progress? Did you grow up? Has it made you hard, for example?
After I crossed the sea, I was hopeful for life.

No. The difficulty of the road. For example, it is like an experience for a person. He says after experiencing the difficulties, one becomes more mature or strong. Were you like that?
The hardship we saw… I became strong the day we were born. OK? Because the days when we saw war and migration and escape and these things. The sea was a different feeling because at that time when I was in Afghanistan and there was a war, we had no children. Whatever we were, we were ourselves. If we were killed, one person would die. We were on this side, I threw my family in the sea. I threw the family in the camp. I started a family in Turkey. These problems increased from me five times to six times. Because the children were not to blame for that. I had brought them in the water. I could not help but think of the situation that I had put the poor things into. I saw Afghanistan, I saw Iran, I saw Turkey. Maybe later they protest for what I have put them through, maybe we drowned then. But it is all experience. Every step is an experience. In Afghanistan, when we fled, we saw the war, we saw Iran, Turkey, this way. Step by step is an experience for me.

You mean you were getting better every day? You grew, you progressed, and you gained new experience.
Experience in terms of life, well yes. But it is not possible.

How, for example?
For example, in life we ​​have not seen any facilities that we can provide for ourselves. This is where we are. Experience does not work for us here anymore.

You no longer can use these experiences.
For example, I say give me a house and teach me. I can do a lot of work for myself there. Life did not work for me, I am a rancher. Life did not work for me, so I open a fruit shop for myself. I will pay for it myself. It is true that I have a physical problem and I hope that things are going well.

On the way you came, for example, on the way to Iran, Turkey or Turkey, Greece, were there any positive points? Was it good?
Well, women were not comfortable in Afghanistan. The children were not comfortable. It was good that outside with my wife and children, my children were wearing veils or, for example, our little one was walking around somewhere, we were not worried.

It meant freedom.
There is freedom. Nobody interferes with anyone. We only saw this positive thing. We did not see anything positive anymore. For example, from the point of view of life, we did not see it from the point of view of others. No.

Does it mean only security?
Well, we only saw security. Security was positive. That is in Turkey, in the middle of places that are popular. Now, when we saw the police, we were scared and stood up because we had nothing. We would see these things again, we would go out, where there were people, where there was a shop, and I would see these things. The freedom was good.

Yep, really. So what do you wish for the future right now? For example, what do you do? What is your dream?
My dream is to finally reach my destination one day. Have a job for myself. Do not eat the government’s rations. Let me just say this. If I go somewhere, the government will give me a house, the government will give me money, the government will give me clothes. That means nothing. I do not have any such hope and expectations. I hope for a place that tells me these are the documents and the card and acceptance and then go and work for yourself. Not in Iran, a developed country. For example, to go to places like Germany, France or Switzerland. There.
The only wish is to get out of here one day. Get a degree. I do not think it will be better after I get accepted. In Greece.

No, at one time some people accepted. Their work does not go ahead. My brother has been waiting for his ID for a year. It has not come yet.
Good job. Because it is a problem in Greece. If I want to move forward, my wish is not to be a burden to the government.

Questions cleared. Thanks for answering. In the end, if you have a message, give a bad message to people or, for example, the person who reads this interview to you. Do you have a message for him or for other people to better understand the situation of immigrants?
My message is to think about immigrants. Because the immigrants who really emigrate from their country, their homeland, the good people, the statesmen who are really benevolent to the immigrant nation, think about the immigrants. Because the immigrant really does not know the language, doesn’t have any authority, and is a displaced person. Do not fail to cooperate as much as they can, as much as they can. We are all one human being; we are all one race. Human rights are no different. Human beings are no different. Treat like a human. Like a human being. No one is superior among themselves. To say someone is better… There is no difference. That was the message from me.

Thanks a lot.